State Games Oddity

Region 8 vs Region 2 game ends in the middle of the 5th with Region 8 having 10 runs; Region 2 no runs. Mercy rule game.

This will later be changed to Region 8 with 9 runs; Region 2 no runs. I don't know when that was decided. The score books didn't jive was the reason.

At what should have been the end of bracket play 3 teams were tied at 2-1. Tie breaker each team has 11 runs given up against them except Region 2, which only had 10 given up.

Here's the tricky part: if it's a run-rule game between Region 8 and Region 2 then all three teams are tied. But since it was decided that Region 8 only had 9 runs Region 8 and Region 2 have to finish their game because it was called in the middle of the 5th. Two days later when the game resumes Region 8 is still the home team with 2 outs, runners at 1st and 3rd. They got out without getting the 10th run across. Sixth inning no one scores. Top of the 7th Region 2 does not score. Game over! Region 8 is not allowed to bat in the bottom of the inning.

Region 8 won the game but Region 2 goes to the Gold Medal game.

 

What is the real deal here?

So if the game ends in 5 innings mercy rule wouldn't that have been the time to dispute the number of runs? If someone came back after the teams had left the field and gone home and said it wasn't mercy rule then they should have been told they should have been told tough break you should have said something at the time. Seems like there is more to this story. It is not the girls fault yet they had to pay the price. The girls of region 8 got the shaft.

 

Don't jump to conclusions until you know the whole story. I'll let someone else who was there post the details, but even phreak does not have the whole story.

 

It was questioned at the end of the game. Both teams had 9-0 at that time. The umpires were questioned and said the the mercy rule was 8-0. With that being said the results should have stood at 8-0. This would have still put Region2 in the Gold Medal game based on the tie breaker of runs allowed. After it was questioned on Tuesday night, the score books suddenly did not jive, but that is a whole other issue. The State games officials did what was right and made the two teams finish the game. The scenarios were numerous in those last two innings. Depending on the final score, any of the 3 teams at 2-1 could have ended up in the medal rounds and any of them in the #3 seed game. Region 2 was able to hold their ground in the game and advance.

The question then came about, why Region 8 did not get to bat in the bottom of the 7th. Well they were the home team and were ahead. The game was over. Official rules of the game state that. If that had been changed then the bottom of the 7th between Region 2 and Region 3 would also have had to gone back and be played.

Overall regardless of what happened, the State Games group did what was right and fair to all teams.

 

Is it about the girls or the adults???

Finishing a game TWO days later changes the momentum of the game. The girls of region 8 had to pay the price because adults obviously didn't know what they were doing. It is not right, I don't care how you look at it. It was not fair to the girls and it is supposed to be about the girls, right? It still sounds fishy to me. It should have been settled right then and there and not still being talked about on Tuesday NIGHT when all of a sudden the scorebooks didn't "jive" hmmmm. The score was 9-0 and if the umpires didn't stop it at 8-0 it is not the girls fault.

 

I don't know of anyone who isn't aware that the mercy rule is 10 runs after 4 1/2 innings. It seems pretty sure that Region 8 had the momentum to make it a mercy game.

I agree that the State Game officials made the fairest decision they could under the circumstances. But those circumstances should have never happened. If the game ended as a mercy rule game believing the score to be 10-0 (as I heard) then the final score should have stood.

 

.......OK, so in HS the mercy rule is 10 runs after 4 1/2 innings?
Therefor, if the home team is ahead after 4 innings by 10 runs, then the visitor team gets their 5th chance at bat, right?
Lets say the score after 4 complete innings was 20 - 0, and after the 5th at for the visitors, who don't score, is the official score 10 - 0?
What happens to the records that may have been broken in the 4th by the home team, after 10 a ten run lead is set, if the score reverts back to a mercy rule score?
If a team forfiets, the official score is 7-0.

How on earth can the gig of 9 runs come into play?

And if tie breakers are used that include runs scored and runs against, then when the umps flip the coin at the plate before the game, and I get a choice, home or away, BAM!, no brainer, I'm taking the visitor side everytime!

Fishdad

 

I have a question and correct me if I am wrong? If you had 3 teams at 2-1. Two of those teams played in the Gold medal game. How come region 3 who was also 2-1 did not play in the Bronse medal game, but instead played in a consolation game?

 

Three of the teams in Bracket A were tied at 2-1. The first tie breaker is how many runs each team allowed to be scored against them. The second tie breaker is how many runs teams score. Apparently Region 8 scored more runs than Region 3 so Region 8 went to the Bronze Medal Game and Region 3 went to Consolation.

Region 3 allowed 11 runs. Consolation Game vs Region 4. Region 3 won Consolation.
Region 8 allowed 11 runs. Bronze Medal Game vs Region 5. Region 5 won Bronze.
Region 2 allowed 10 runs. Gold Medal Game vs Region 6. Region 6 won Gold.
The loser of the Gold Medal Game is awarded Silver.

 

District 6 Chairperson

Not one person who has posted in this thread has the story entirely correct, so please allow me to provide the missing details so that everyone understands that the State Games Committee did all that should have been done.

Monday's matchup between Region 8 and Region 2 was called in the fifth inning as a mercy rule because the scoreboard said 10-0. The umpires based their mercy decision on the board. BOTH coaches (region 8 AND region 2) approached the announcing table after the game with only 9 runs recorded in their scorebooks. This was confirmed by the two NSR reps AND an uninvolved college coach who was also sitting at the table. Someone (I'm not sure who) told the coaches that the mercy rule was 8-0. Regardless of who made this comment, all coaches involved have been coaching high school ball, and both Jeff and Butch (the two umpires) are active high school umpires - all involved know the mercy rule is 10. Regardless of this discrepancy, NO ONE approached either Pop (NC Fastpitch President), Jeff (State Games rep), or I (D6 chairperson) about the situation at this time. Our official record of score was 9-0, and no one caught the fact that the game had been ended after five.

After Tuesday's games, we began the tallying to determine seeding for Wednesday's games. Regions 2, 3, and 8 all finished with a record of 2 wins and 1 loss. The FIRST tiebreaker was head to head. Region 2 beat Region 3, Region 3 beat Region 8, and Region 8 beat Region 2. Therefore, all three teams canceled each other out on head to head. The SECOND tiebreaker was runs allowed. Based on our information, Region 2 had 10 runs allowed, while Regions 3 and 8 had 11 runs allowed. This would mean Region 2 went to the gold medal game, while 3 and 8 went to the THIRD tiebreaker, which was runs scored. Region 8 had the most runs scored, so they went to the bronze medal game while Region 3 went to consolation. We made this announcement Tuesday night. Immediately, the Region 8 coaches approached us saying we had made a mistake. Their book showed that 10 runs had been scored in the first game, which would make all three regions tied at the second tiebreaker (runs allowed) as well. In that case, based on runs scored, Region 8 would go to the gold, Region 3 to the bronze and Region 2 to consolation. The Region 8 coach stated that he had had to go back through his book after the game to correct hits/errors/etc, and that was where he had seen the missed run. Both books were compared to find the error.

Based on the fact that immediately following the game, both books had 9 runs as the official score, and there was no way for the state games committee to say one coach was right and the other was wrong, we determined the most fair way to solve the problem was resume the game in the bottom half of the fifth inning, exactly where it was left off, with 9 runs, again because that was what both books had confirmed at the conclusion of Monday's game.

The other details listed about the game were correct - it was bottom of the fifth, two outs, runners on first and third. If Region 8 had scored immediately, the game would have ended and they'd have gone to the gold medal game. There were actually a multitude of outcomes that could have happened; for example, if the game had ended 10-1, then Region 3 would have gone to the gold medal game (b/c Region 2 would have 11 runs allowed, and Region 8 would have had 12 runs allowed). If the game had ended 9-2, then Region 2 would go to gold game, Region 3 to bronze, and Region 8 to consolation. And so on and so on.

Ultimately, no runs were scored by either team and the initial seeding was correct - Region 2 to gold, Region 8 to bronze, Region 3 to consolation. Region 8 argued they should have been allowed to hit in the bottom of the 7th and that they were unfairly robbed of a chance to go to the gold. HOWEVER - these final innings were NOT played as a tiebreaker, in which case their argument would have been valid. The innings were played to ensure that the tiebreaker was applied appropriately. Had they been allowed to hit in the bottom of the 7th, it would then have become necessary to go back and allow each home team who had been winning another chance to hit, as that may have also affected runs allowed/scored. Not to mention the fact that it is the rules of the game for it to be called in the middle of the seventh if the home team is ahead.

As I said before, no one approached Pop, Jeff, or I about the discrepancy until it became an issue about seeding for medal games. The entire situation could have been avoided had it been brought up on Monday.

The tournament was a success and I firmly stand behind the great experience it was for all the girls involved. I hope this explanations provides enough information for everyone to move on and focus on the positive nature of the state games experience.