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Baseball Talk: Hitting, Pitching, Catching Strategy

Discussion in 'Baseball' started by NCBBallFan, Jan 30, 2003.

Most Important Ages for Development

  1. 8-10 (Winner)

    8 vote(s)
    33.3%
  2. 11-12 (Also Ran)

    5 vote(s)
    20.8%
  3. 13-14 (Runnerup)

    8 vote(s)
    33.3%
  4. 15-16 (Out of the Running)

    3 vote(s)
    12.5%
  5. 18-20 (No one cares)

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. NCBBallFan

    NCBBallFan Retired ex-moderator

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    Remember Merkle? Bone-head plays.

    I really should have said "Remember hearing about Merkle?" This was a LONG time ago
    The infamous Merkle Boner!

    Fred Merkle's bonehead play in 1908 cost the Giants a victory. Because of his play, the game had to be replayed and the Giants lost the rematch. The key was that the rematch was at the end of the season and the Cubs won.

    The Play: Merkle was the runner on first. He failed to touch second after an base hit by Al Bridwell. Instead, he went back toward the dugout (most players did this at the time), when he saw the "winning" run cross the plate.

    The Polo Grounds crowd filed across the field towards the centerfield gate (yep - across the playing field). Second baseman Johnny Evers (Double Play combo "Tinker to Evers to Chance") got the ball, stepped on second and yelled for a forceout which cancelled the winning run.

    The fans were all over the field. The game couldn't be restarted.
    After much discussion and bickering, it was decided that the game had to be replayed.

    "The Giants lost the pennant...The Giants lost the pennant!"

    Ok guys..... Over the years we've all seen some great Merkle's....... Lets share 'em. They can be pro, minor, college, high-school or kid ball.
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2003
  2. cc12501

    cc12501 Full Access Member

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    I remember hearing about how Olde Providence lost to Sotheast Charlotte in All-Stars. O.P. is up easily on S.E. One of O.P.'s players started to get very upset at the umpire and almost got thrown out at one time. Another problem occured when O.P. could not sub anyone into the game anymore; so those nine had to finish the game. That same player got mad at another call and was ejected from the game, and since they only had 8 to play, they had to forefit the game, and S.E. Charlotte got the win.
     
  3. NCBBallFan

    NCBBallFan Retired ex-moderator

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    Rule 7.08 (i)

    Some baseball rules have a good history. Read this rule carefully and see if you can figure out why it was written.

    Rule 7.08 (i) After he has acquired legal possession of a base, a runner runs the bases in reverse order for the purpose of confusing the defense or making a travesty of the game. The umpire shall immediately call "Time" and declare the runner out.

    It's a great story! Answer to follow later.
     
  4. NCBBallFan

    NCBBallFan Retired ex-moderator

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    Answer to Rule 7.08 (i) question.

    1908: The situation that it came up in was the "double steal" with runners at 1st and 3rd. In those days, you couldn't wait for the 3 run homer. Only two player hit over 9 homers the entire season so everyone played "smallball".

    Detroit had a pretty fast squad. One of their speedsters was named Davy Jones (not the singer, I promise). He was on third base and Germany Schaefer was the runner at first.

    Players didn't use managers or 3B coaches to tell them what to do in those days, they looked at each other and signaled each other. On the first pitch to the next batter, Germany took off and stole 2B, hoping for a throwdown so Jones could steal home. But the catcher didn't bite. On the next pitch, Schaefer let out a war hoop and stole first base from 2nd. The Cleveland team was so shocked that they just watched him do it! He yelled his intent across the diamond to Jones that he was going to go again. Sure enough, on the next pitch he took off and the catcher, Nig Clarke, tried to throw him out.

    Sure enough, Jones scored from third on the throw. This was back in the day when Ty Cobb sharpened his spikes with a file to punnish middle infielders who tried to tag him out and base runners slid with their spikes at face level. It's not surprizing that there wasn't a throw home on the play.

    Oddly enough, this was the third time that someone had "stolen first" in the big leagues, but it's the one that's remembered. The rule was changed in about 1920.

    :stooges:
     
  5. NCBBallFan

    NCBBallFan Retired ex-moderator

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    Two Players, One position, Same Play?

    Only one time in the history of baseball can I find where there were two players playing the same position during the same play. Any ideas

    I'm not talking about a "shift" or 5 infielders or anything like that. Actually having 10 people involved in A SINGLE play on defense at the same time. Answer to follow.
     
  6. NCBBallFan

    NCBBallFan Retired ex-moderator

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    Answer to 10-men question

    Back in the 1880's no substitutions were allowed except in the case of injury. This kinda eliminated all that strategic stuff about lefty-righty matchups and forget relievers....unheard of. If it was your day to pitch, you pitched.....both games.

    Before the beginning of the 1891 season, baseball added a substitution rule, but this was without looking at how people in baseball "bend" rules (see emory boards, sand paper, etc). The rule just stated that you could substitute at anytime by announcing the switch.

    "Now catching for Boston, Mike Kelly"

    Mike "King" Kelly of Boston used the rule when he jumped off the bench to catch a foul ball. He saw that the Boston catcher had no chance to make the play, so he substituted himself in as the catcher while the ball was in the air.

    Hence....10 defensive players on one play. Needless to say, the rule was quickly modified.

    :cool:
     
  7. Braves

    Braves Watauga Pioneers #6

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    Hey NCBBall, I had heard that you actually witnessed those plays...any truth to the rumors? :D
     
  8. NCBBallFan

    NCBBallFan Retired ex-moderator

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    Believe it or not, I was around for the next one..... Naw, I'm one of those unfortunates that loves the game, loves to read and remembers tiny little details for decades ..... and can't find my car in the parking lot .... or my way home from the grocery store!
    :D :invasion: :laugher: :laugher:
     
  9. NCBBallFan

    NCBBallFan Retired ex-moderator

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    Last one guys: Rule 7.09 (g)

    Last one....The origin of this rule is in "some of our" life times. It's definately in mine. No, I'm not 80 and bed-ridden.....just rode hard and put up wet.

    The rule states:
    Rule 7.09 (g) If, in the judgment of the umpire, a base runner willfully and deliberately interferes with a batted ball or a fielder in the act of fielding a batted ball with the obvious intent to break up a double play, the ball is dead. The umpire shall call the runner out for interference and also call out the batter runner because of the action of his teammate. In no event may bases be run or runs scored because of such action by a runner.

    Question.....When & why did they write it, what was the rule before.
    :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :thinking: :jawomg:
     
  10. gonzo

    gonzo Full Access Member

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    I am not the baseball scholar that NCBBallFan is, but I do have a funny story. My son was pitching a SE Charlotte Rec game when he was 14 or 15. Runners at the corners, one out. In those days, he had a tendency to overthrow, which of course led to some wildness. He throws one that winds up headed for the top of thee hitters helmet, so of course the hitter ducks straight down. But he leaves the bat sticking up, the ball hits the bat and rolls straight back to the mound. The other teams runners just stand there, but our team responded perfectly, turning a 1-6-3 double play, out of the inning, yeah!
     

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