Baseball Talk: Hitting, Pitching, Catching Strategy

#1. Catcher (terribly inadequate coaching knowledge and instruction)

#2. Third base (most coaches just throw a player out there...once he proves he has the reflexes to handle the hot corner, they just hit him ground balls in practice ... no instruction - he's on his own).

 

You all are probably right that outfielders get the least amount of instruction. Probably because a coach doesn't know how for one thing and relies on the hope that his outfielders can run down a fly ball and catch it at the same time when they were mis-positioned to start with.

3B is another one of those positions that isn't coached well along with the catcher. I've seen pitching coaches who don't know their ass from a hole in the ground.

As to your stereotypes Braves:

1st base- Big hitter, can scoop bounced balls
A first baseman has to be as fearless as the 3Bman. First base also seems to have the reputation of being the least athletic guy on the field.

2nd base- good hands and feet, weak arm
I agree, but in reality, a good 2Bman has at least as good an arm as the SS. They usually seem to be the weakest hitter on a club a lot of times.

ss - good hands, good feet, strong arm
The SS is usually the best athlete on the team with a good bat in addition to the qualities you listed.

3rd- good hands, strong hitter, slow feet
A 3Bman has to be fearless, they also have to be quick in their reactions to a hard hit ball or they get killed. It doesn't hurt for them to smart as well.

catcher- fat kid, good hitter
You're right, coaches usually put the fat kid behind the plate, like the one old Boilermaker put behind the plate in the Bad News Bears, I can't think of his name. In reality, catchers need to have mobility and quickness. IMHO, they should also be one of the smartest kids on the team. The catcher is the one player that can see the ball in front of every player and can see the whole field. He is the traffic cop of the team and ought to be the general calling the shots. He has to know what a batter did in his previous at-bat and he has to know his pitcher's ability to get the job done on that particular day. If there was ever a coach on the field it is this position.

outfielder- can catch flyballs
Speed doesn't hurt and depth perception is critical. The best outfielders don't immediately judge a ball visually. They do it by sound. They know a strong sharp sound is a well hit ball and they are off to the races as they pick it up visually. I know one high school kid that can do this and realizes he can do it. He is very good.

Pitcher- throw strikes
Throwing strikes is definitely a plus, but smart pitching along with a good catcher is worth its weight in gold to me. You can't just throw strikes, you have to make a batter think you're throwing strikes and make him chase the occasional bad pitch. The pitcher that throws strikes consistently is going to get killed late in the game when he's tired and running out of gas. That's why running is so important for pitchers. They have to learn how to pace themselves too.

 

I was being facetious in the generalization of the sterotypes.

..and I certainly agree with your opinion of a good catcher. But it seems that there are pitching coaches, catching coaches and fielding coaches that are good in teaching fundamentals and tricks of the trade. But it is rare on the HS level to see a coach spend quality time with the outfielders; teaching the fundamentals and tricks of the trade. The most common theme is " go shag balls"

But what the heck do I know. I'm biased.. I was one of those " go shag balls for awhile, then hit a few"

 

No offense intended Braves, you were right on in your stereotypes. I was adding my opinion of what the position really needed and what a coach needed to look for.

Outfielders are kind of left to their own devices to figure out how to play the position. In your stereotypes we needed to go a step farther and stereotype the outfielders

LF - Not good enough to be an infielder
CF - Fastest player on the team
RF - You sentence the worst player on the team to RF

In reality all of them need good speed and arms, and the RF probably should have the gun on him over the other two positions. I guess they get less coaching because they only have 2 things to do: catch the ball and get it back in. I realize that is overly simplistic, but is basically the case. I guess the more flies you shag the better you are at it. Maybe that's the coaching philosophy there. I'll bet there are very few coaches that can teach a kid to play the ball off of the "sound" of the contact. I'd even bet there are even fewer that have ever heard of the concept. If I can find the article I read about that, I'll post the link.

It's another good discussion question though.

 

I don't know if this will change to a hyperlink or not. It is a link to the story about outfielders playing by sound as well as visual cues.

http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnflash/jun2001/nf20010628_637.htm

 

good story..I wish they could have related the sound to a metal bat....Ping and Pong

 

Another common rotation I've seen for RF is the next game's pitcher. Has a strong arm but won't see a lot of action. The arm is there if you need it but hopefully, he won't have to use it. (Particularly if your pitchers are good hitters - which is the case usually in H.S.)

 

To all of you guys above:

I agree with all of you on your baseball position analyses except with your COMPLETE description and analysis of the catcher stereotype. Open your eyes! The fat catcher of olden days has long pasted and have been told so many, many times by college coaches and scouts unless you have a high school team that is less than adequate!

Sure a catcher has to be smart, a good hitter, and is the traffic cop of the team! But the catchers of modern day times are now mean, lean and quick! A rigorous workout by catchers is now very much essential, as upper body strength is a necessity at this position (as well as other positions too, of course). Fast movement behind the plate for passed balls and the quick pop times down to second from home are essential qualities in a catcher these days which leaves no room for heavy and chubby catchers these days. If your team does have a fat catcher, you will surely be burned on defense behind the plate! Usually one of the quickest and strongest players on college baseball teams these days is the catcher! Put you don't have to take my word for it...just look around!

 

In some areas your steryotypes are right, but there are some things that arent true, in my opinion:

1st: usually ur big hitter, but thats because thats where they stick the guys who cant play anywhere else when there older but can straight pole. in high school it depends our first baseman this year is smaller and can hit for average, hit around .370 last year, but no bombs. you dont need the long ball to win high school games thats a different story. last year our first baseman was dh'ed for, but was a heck of a defensive 1st baseman, guess it depends on the coach.

2nd: quick feet definately, good hands is a must, but a good arm is absolutely necessary. RELAYS AND BASERUNNING win or lose ball games, so if ur team has a 2nd baseman with a weak harm, good luck, with our team we'll exploit that. offense does vary, our 2nd baseman is a great 2 hole hitter, he's clutch plus he can move runners over.

SS: USUALLY your best athlete but not always. speed and an arm are important. strong leader. strong defense is important for the SS, offense is a plus but does not have to be an offensive powerhouse.

3rd: if you have a 3B with slow feet, your in trouble. any team that has a good coach or one that has any sense will again exploit that disadvanage. unless you have a great athlete on the mound u could bunt all over a slow 3B. plus i agree that 3B's must have good reactions, but its and oxymoron to say slow 3B with good reactions. traditionally ur corner guys have the most power, which i think holds true for the most part. the one thing that stands out most in a 3B has to be the arm.

Catcher: good leader is a must, as is a good arm, but the arm means nothing without accuracy and quick feet. if u have a catcher with all 3, ur in good shape. a good pop time what most coaches evaluate kids on these days. traditionally ur catchers dont have a whole lot of speed due to the wear and tear on the knee, but htere are some occasional freaks. offense usually varies. being a pitcher i think ur catcher must be able to receive well, plus he must be smart, remeber hes callin ur game.

pitcher: the most impotant thing for a pitcher is strikes, a pitcher must also have a good tempo, i hate when i see guys take a week to throw a pitch and then get mad when an error is made, its partly his fault for puttin his players to sleep. pitchers gotta be smart, able to read hitters, and call a good game, although some coaches help out here. velocity always helps, but if u throw strikes and ur ball isnt straight as an arrow, u should be successful, hte addtion of an offspeed pitch is necessary.

LF: i think he is usually ur weakest arm, not necessarilly the slowest but more then likely so, most LF have good sticks.

CF: best defensive outfielder, usually with the most speed. traditionally the guys up the middle of the field were ur defense, but baseball has changed a lot of CF can mash

RF: best arm in the outfield, speed not necessary, but definately will take the kid farther, most of the time they got a good stick.

dont mean to offend anyone these are just my opinion

 

Hey guys, you're mssing the point of the topic. It's least coached position, not position stereotypes or I would have gone into much more detail about that.

Based on the responses, I guess the stereotype topic would have been better and I wouldn't have glossed over it.

Listen, I agree with the descriptions, partcularly the catcher. Actually, there is no room for that fat guy anymore in baseball, except one......the coach!..and you rarely see that anymore