USSSA ethics?

Fellow Coaches..

I was looking at the USSSA tournament schedule and Who's playing list yesterday and I was interested in the August 4/5 and August 25/26 dates both of which have teams signed up for them. I also noticed ASA was in Oxford that those two weekends.

I had heard from a friend of mine that there was some sort of agreement or understanding between the two parks that if one sanction was in one park, the other sanction couldn't be in the other. So, I called the parks directly.

WOW...According to the gentleman I spoke with, USSSA doesn't have anything scheduled at Henderson after Memorial Day weekend. How do you list teams or a tournament on a schedule that you don't even have? Seems pretty unethical and misleading to me. I wonder how many other tournaments he has done this with? I'm willing to bet he has done it in other places as well. Think about it. How many times do you sign up for one place and then find out on Tuesday (after other organizations have cancelled) that you have to be moved to a different park? Don't even get me started on the times you sign up to play and then get moved. Like this morning...54 teams signed up to play in Smithfield. There's no way all 54 teams can play in Smithfield. 54 Teams and only 18 get to play there! That's crazy. Nothing against Pine Level, but the bathrooms there are horrible. The fields at Micro are sketchy and there is absolutely nothing nearby if you are on a short break. And correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't there a HS age group signed up to play? What happened to them?

USSSA has had the monopoly on softball in the east for far too long and I think it is high time to give some one else a shot. I've talked with several coaches about playing ASA and almost everyone of them has brought this up in the conversation, "You know Rod isn't going to like that" or "You play ASA and you know you'll be on the USSSA shit list". A couple of coaches I have talked to who actually signed up for an ASA tournament said they were called and made to feel intimidated about trying to play ASA.

Am I missing something? Is USSSA sponsoring those teams? He sure isn't mine and I'll be darned if anyone is going to tell my team where we can or can not play. I've played a lot of USSSA (USFA) in the past, but it's time to put on my big boy pants and try something a little different. I understand this is a business and that USSSA is trying to protect it, but like any other business, you got to treat your customers right. I certainly wouldn't go back to a restaurant that called me and harassed me about eating somewhere else. Why would this be any different?

 

Travel

Travel Ball coach, It sounds like you have a personal issue with the USSSA tournament director. You have many options to choose from, ASA, NSA, IFA, Pony, Triple Crown, WFC, to just name a few in a three state area. All these sanctioning bodies have good and bad issues. Some markets are stronger ASA,or NSA, and contol the teams much like you have described. This is why it is called Travel Ball. Try your luck in the west, south, or north. But do not bad mouth a successful business. You have the right to choose any tournament you want to enter, anywhere you want to play. You are the customer and if you are unhappy take your business elsewhere. Just don't belly ache about it on a forum like this. You will not get much support. Remember you do not have to give your money to anyone you do not wish to. Good luck with your season.

 

If the information is accurate, he has every right to complain wherever he feels like... but he better be right. A business has an obligation to satisfy customers and customers should attempt to get satisfaction from the business first but in the event that they cant, then they have a right to complain in any suitable venue that will listen.

 

You're right and that is very well what we may have to. It's unfortunate though that teams are subject to this type of attitude and tactics. Not everyone has the option to travel a rather short distance as we do to play other tournaments like ASA, NSA, or IFA. With gas being what it is, the economy being tough, not everyone can afford out of town stays so we try and play local as much as we can just as I'm sure everyone else does.

Do I have a personal issue with the USSSA tournament director? Not until I feel like he's trying to pull one over on me or my team. Do I feel mislead...absolutely.

USSSA provides a place to play ball for teams and that's great. But it crosses the line when they start threatening teams and harassing them about where they sign up or posting tournaments that don't exist. I just don't see the point in that and am surprised someone would do that. What purpose does that serve? I can't think of any other than to drive the bank account up. What other business calls people and tries to intimidate them when they shop elsewhere?

And by the way...I've traveled west and played ASA, NSA many times. I've never been made to feel threatened or harassed by any of the tournament directors there and I've never heard of that happening from anyone out that way. Not saying it hasn't, but haven't heard anything like that.

I would have to think that it doesn't as those organizations seem to work together. Doesn't NSA and ASA run a tournament together for a children's hospital or something? It would seem that when you have that many other options, (NSA,ASA,TOP GUN,IFA) in the west that you couldn't use the sort of tactics USSSA does. Maybe it's not happened to you so it seems like belly aching. Go ahead and sign up for something else in USSSA's back yard and see what happens or talk to some of the others who have. I feel like teams put up with it because they (teams) feel like they have to. As I said, not everyone has the option to travel.

I guess a better analogy is the story of two short stops...When you have two shortstops they keep each other working hard to get better. However, when you were the first short stop, you are a little nervous about the coach bringing on a new one as it may effect your playing time. In the end, a little competition is always a good thing isn't it?

Good luck on your season as well.

 

Time will tell

As funny as this may seem from a coaches standpoint but I disagree with what you are saying about the Henderson tournaments. Therefore, I made my own calls to the Aycock Recreation Park on Friday. They in fact informed me that NC USSSA did have tournaments posted there through the end of August and there were going to be several more there in the fall. They also stated that there was NO gentlemen's agreement between parks not to hold tournaments if another nearby park was holding a tournament at their facility on that same weekend.

It seems to me that either you are good friends with a director of another association or you are in fact jealous of anyone who works hard and is successful in business. I have been playing USFA tournaments for many years and now I am playing with USSSA. Even though I may not always agree with what is done I can say that across the board USFA and USSSA has always treated all my teams equally. They have raised money for many great causes over the years and have continued that tradition this year. So to me it seems that you are whining about something stupid but please don't hide behind a computer and say stupid shit that when I take time to check out your accusations are found to hold no truth at all.

 

Ok folks lets not go to name calling I am sure there is truth in both of your statements, maybe some miscommunication with other folks I do know that usssa does over book venues and forces you to move sometimes, seems to happen fairly regualarly, maybe they tell you that upfront if so then it was it is. U trip formally USFA has had a pretty strong hold in the southeastern part of the state for a long time

 

My opinion

My dd has played in the east for a few years now and has always played USFA (now USSSA) until recently. In all those years and the many games we've played at tournaments, I don't think I've ever seen a USFA director interact with people and kids the way the ASA tournament director did in Clayton. He joked around with everyone, talked to the kids...I can't explain it very well but it was just a different attitude than what I'm used to and several of our team's parents commented on that also.

As far as the intimidation and stuff..and I will preface this with I don't know if it is true, only that it was said. While watching one of our games, I did over hear a coach from another team make the comment to the tournament director that "he paid the price" for playing ASA that weekend and that he was called several times by USSSA and given a hard time about playing there.

 

Newbie,
If you do not not know if it is true, why say anything?

 

Can't speak for anyone else, but we did play in this same ASA tournament. We were not targeted per say because we have played several ASA tournaments and USSSA knows that not only our team but our Organization typically plays the other sanctions frequently. I don't think he likes it but I don't think he as ever treated us differently because of it. Actually sometimes he seems like he goes out of his way to please us when we do play...

However, I did receive the call and what was said was...Are you still planning on playing the ASA in Clayton? because several of those teams have moved to my Pine Level\Smithfield tournament....
Now, that is not directly asking to switch but it is trying to influence our decision. Is it right? probably not but I don't see it ending anytime soon.
Like Spiritscoach said above, us teams and coaches choose where we play not the directors and we do have options.
Especially since the teams in this particular tournament that moved were mostly teams that were going to be more competitive at the other location. Which in my opinion is really the problem....ASA, NSA typically get the more competitive teams and teams that are willing\wanting to travel to play those more comptetitive teams. Recently it seems that these tournaments have fallen off in our area and you have to go west of Raleigh to play them. A lot of the teams in the East seem to be 'stuck' to the East. Hopefully with the new Eastern ASA this will bring some of these back.

Honestly, I can say that the tournaments run by USSSA are just as well run as the other sanctions...sometimes better and sometimes worse. My biggest complaint with USSSA is the over booking of teams that was mentioned above. Then you end up having to play at a different location than what is advertised for. Not always a big deal until you end up at Selma middle school when you planned to be at a nice park like Clayton or Smithfield.